View unanswered posts | View active topics It is currently Mon May 20, 2013 1:52 am



Reply to topic  [ 42 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3  Next
 Optimizing gear across SRT and DRT setups 
Author Message
User avatar

Joined: Wed Apr 25, 2007 10:25 am
Posts: 4062
Location: Jamaica Plain, Massachusetts
Post Optimizing gear across SRT and DRT setups
I've been refining a minimal but relatively easy to use SRT system which reuses DRT gear components and visa versa. The goal is to have a minimal, lightweight and effective system for either DRT or SRT climbing. The system is based on an NT Tengu harness. You've all seen some of this before, this is a more integrated system refining past setups.

The base gear set

Image
Description:
1. Microcender is used for SRT ascent and as a progress capture for SRT traverse.
2. Hitch, pulley and carabiner used for DRT and SRT (back up ascender for SRT)
3. Pantin used with single foot lock technique to put both feet on the rope SRT or DRT

When climbing a cinched rope the hitch is already in place for transition from SRT to DRT.

For either DRT or SRT the hitch just rides the rope, doesn't need to be moved up by hand.

The ascender tether is long enough so that if the ascender slips under shock loading during SRT ascent it will not release the hitch.


Keeping the upper 2/3's of the pear screwlink clear and available for attachments DRT or SRT

Image
Description:
1. Vinyl tape is used to tighten the harness belt eyes on both sides of the pear screwlink.
2. The harness belt eye on the left won't go above the locking nut on the screwlink.
3. Vinyl tape wrapped on right side of screwlink to prevent the harness belt eye from moving up.
4. Blue carabiner is through the eye on the leg strap D, it is used to hold the hitch for DRT or SRT.

Image
Description:
Enough vinyl tape is wrapped on the right side of the pear so that harness belt eye won't move up but the swivel can still slide over it to stay out of the way.


Custom tether for microcender

Image
Description:
Girthing a sling to the microcender creates an unbalanced load on the ascender. To solve a 48" rated dynema sling is doubled through the microcender attachment opening. The doubled sling is pulled through a length of tubular webbing to keep the four legs of the sling tidy. Vinyl tape is used to keep the webbing cover in place on the doubled sling. Enough room is left at the bottom so that the tether can be girthed on to the pear screwlink. When not in use the microcender remains tethered and is stowed in a small zippered bag on the side of the harness belt.

Note:
1. The SRT system is pretty good but not as comfortable as a Yo-Yo and not as efficient as a Tree Frog but it is effective and safe.

2. The screwlink nut can be opened to remove the swivel and the pear can be rotated and taken out of the harness belt eyes with a little effort. I always leave my pear on the harness between climbs so it is not an issue.

Everything shown has been tested over many climbs, as usual you are responsible for your own safety when you modify gear or create custom systems or components.

Also on Flicker here
-moss


Mon Jan 04, 2010 9:36 pm
Profile WWW
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 20, 2009 9:56 am
Posts: 130
Location: Oakland, California
Post 
That's a nice compact set of gear. I like how much gear is usable both in SRT and DRT.

Your modification of the Tengu Pearlink + harness eyes looks pretty nice, I'm glad you posted details on that. I think I'll look at something similar, except I've got no vinyl tape around and electrical tape might be a bit thin. It looks like your changes will keep the pearlink nice and clear... can't wait to give it a shot.

_________________
John


Mon Jan 04, 2010 10:36 pm
Profile
User avatar

Joined: Wed Apr 25, 2007 10:25 am
Posts: 4062
Location: Jamaica Plain, Massachusetts
Post 
CaliJohn wrote:
That's a nice compact set of gear. I like how much gear is usable both in SRT and DRT.

Your modification of the Tengu Pearlink + harness eyes looks pretty nice, I'm glad you posted details on that. I think I'll look at something similar, except I've got no vinyl tape around and electrical tape might be a bit thin. It looks like your changes will keep the pearlink nice and clear... can't wait to give it a shot.


It's vinyl electric tape, it's the duct tape of tree climbing, I use it for many non-life support applications.
-moss


Mon Jan 04, 2010 10:57 pm
Profile WWW
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 20, 2009 9:56 am
Posts: 130
Location: Oakland, California
Post 
It must leave no residue, right? Is that really just ordinary electrical tape, not even extra wide or thick? Well then, that's even easier than I thought!

_________________
John


Mon Jan 04, 2010 11:14 pm
Profile
Post 
I would have never thought of some of that stuff, especially the taping. very smart thinking! experience shows. Aside from technicality, those are nice high quality pictures as well, thanks for a detailed description!

When descent time comes on SRT are you removing the microcender and descending on the hitch? I assume this is the case, but just making sure. I've never descended SRT with just a hitch, honestly it kind of creeps me out. Descending DRT with the hitch, no problem, I have some mechanical advantage to help me stop myself in the event of the hitch failing. This is all probably inexperience gear trusting talking, first time I rappelled with an F8 I worried the same way.


Tue Jan 05, 2010 12:28 am
User avatar

Joined: Wed Apr 25, 2007 10:25 am
Posts: 4062
Location: Jamaica Plain, Massachusetts
Post 
cookiecutter wrote:
When descent time comes on SRT are you removing the microcender and descending on the hitch? I assume this is the case, but just making sure. I've never descended SRT with just a hitch, honestly it kind of creeps me out. Descending DRT with the hitch, no problem, I have some mechanical advantage to help me stop myself in the event of the hitch failing. This is all probably inexperience gear trusting talking, first time I rappelled with an F8 I worried the same way.


Definitely not descending SRT on the hitch. For descent you'd switch over to what ever rappel system you prefer. I use a Grigri.
-moss


Tue Jan 05, 2010 7:33 am
Profile WWW
Post 
moss wrote:
Definitely not descending SRT on the hitch. For descent you'd switch over to what ever rappel system you prefer. I use a Grigri.
-moss


Ok. That is what I was thinking in the back of my mind, just didn't want to criticize something I hadn't tried. I like your system. Looks a lot more canyoneer to me, in the minimalist aspect of it.


Tue Jan 05, 2010 5:08 pm
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 20, 2009 9:56 am
Posts: 130
Location: Oakland, California
Post Re: Optimizing gear across SRT and DRT setups
moss wrote:
Keeping the upper 2/3's of the pear screwlink clear and available for attachments DRT or SRT

Image
Description:
1. Vinyl tape is used to tighten the harness belt eyes on both sides of the pear screwlink.
2. The harness belt eye on the left won't go above the locking nut on the screwlink.
3. Vinyl tape wrapped on right side of screwlink to prevent the harness belt eye from moving up.
4. Blue carabiner is through the eye on the leg strap D, it is used to hold the hitch for DRT or SRT.


Well, I went ahead and duplicated that on my own pear screwlink. It works great so far (just tried a quick clip-in and 10 foot climb). The screwlink actually stands out prominently now and looks to be positioned perfectly. There doesn't seem to be much stress on the tape in the eyes, either, but I made several wraps for security. Initially I was concerned about being able to move or remove the screwlink, but then I realized I almost never need to do that. Worst case I'd have to remove and replace a bit of the tape.

Thank you Moss!

_________________
John


Tue Jan 05, 2010 10:27 pm
Profile
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 20, 2009 9:56 am
Posts: 130
Location: Oakland, California
Post 
Moss, another question, you must prefer the microcender for some reason over another ascender, perhaps size or use in traversing? I suppose pretty much any ascender works in this system; I've used my Ascension for some rudimentary SRT using basically this setup.

_________________
John


Tue Jan 05, 2010 10:31 pm
Profile
User avatar

Joined: Wed Apr 25, 2007 10:25 am
Posts: 4062
Location: Jamaica Plain, Massachusetts
Post 
You're welcome. I'd been using a webbing strap for awhile and then the current solution hit me, eureka! Much better and more simple.

I put a good number of wraps to create the tight eyes, you can pretty much tell when you're wrapping how much is enough.

When your weight is on the rope the screwlink position will always be good. The problem is when you slack the rope then the screwlink can rotate or the harness belt loop rides up over the the nut and stays there when you reload the rope. So what I've proposed solves the problem of the screwlink falling out of position when the rope is slacked or for instance when you're walking around on the ground and you look down and see your pear is sideways or inverted.
-moss


Last edited by moss on Tue Jan 05, 2010 10:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Tue Jan 05, 2010 10:38 pm
Profile WWW
User avatar

Joined: Wed Apr 25, 2007 10:25 am
Posts: 4062
Location: Jamaica Plain, Massachusetts
Post 
CaliJohn wrote:
Moss, another question, you must prefer the microcender for some reason over another ascender, perhaps size or use in traversing? I suppose pretty much any ascender works in this system; I've used my Ascension for some rudimentary SRT using basically this setup.


I prefer a handled ascender. For instance if I'm heading out to a tree and I'm targeting a tall conifer I'm definitely bringing my Tree Frog SRT gear and a 200 ft. static. The point of this system is to have a minimal SRT system available when I'm going to the woods with a 150 ft. arb rope and I don't know what I'm climbing or whether I'll use SRT or not until I see the tree I want to climb. Sometimes I don't decide DRT or SRT until I'm setting the rope, maybe I can't get a cambium saver into place because of a tight squeeze, go to plan B, cinch the rope and climb SRT. The microcender is compact and no big deal if I don't end up using it, I don't mind having it on the harness. I know it seems minor to distinguish between a handled ascender and a microcender but every piece of gear I can shrink down means less bulk on my harness.

I like the microcender for an SRT traverse progress capture, no teeth, compact, there's a lot to like. It's not as easy to use for straight up ascent as a handled ascender.
-moss


Tue Jan 05, 2010 10:50 pm
Profile WWW
User avatar

Joined: Wed Nov 07, 2007 11:05 am
Posts: 425
Location: Sonoma County, California, USA, Northern Hemisphere, Earth, Sol System, Milky Way, Known Universe
Post 
moss wrote:
You're welcome. I'd been using a webbing strap for awhile and then the current solution hit me, eureka! Much better and more simple.


Great idea! thanks for sharing. I've been meaning to try out your webbing strap technique for some time but fortunately I postponed until the newest model came out. I'll be doing this as soon as I get back to my climbing gear.

So while we're on the subject, I've tried (on four separate occassions) attaching my croll and my distel to the leg strap D. I have not been able to get it comfortable in the crotch region - I find that when I load the Croll or hitch, the leg straps ride up - reducing critical space for my anatomy. Any tips? It was much worse with the Croll due to the HUT holding the leg straps up...

_________________
Diversity lends strength.

---

Find a tree, climb the tree, leave it as you found it.


Wed Jan 06, 2010 2:43 pm
Profile
User avatar

Joined: Wed Apr 25, 2007 10:25 am
Posts: 4062
Location: Jamaica Plain, Massachusetts
Post 
Oak wrote:
moss wrote:
You're welcome. I'd been using a webbing strap for awhile and then the current solution hit me, eureka! Much better and more simple.


Great idea! thanks for sharing. I've been meaning to try out your webbing strap technique for some time but fortunately I postponed until the newest model came out. I'll be doing this as soon as I get back to my climbing gear.

So while we're on the subject, I've tried (on four separate occassions) attaching my croll and my distel to the leg strap D. I have not been able to get it comfortable in the crotch region - I find that when I load the Croll or hitch, the leg straps ride up - reducing critical space for my anatomy. Any tips? It was much worse with the Croll due to the HUT holding the leg straps up...


Don't know the answer. Most male climbers have to play a little dodge ball while they're climbing, some wear a cup, some are escape artists, others wince and bear it. Looking to Rogue Industries Research Labs to investigate and come up with an answer.

Next time I climb I'll see what I'm doing differently and report back. We might need a new forum category called "The pain of being a man".

PS: Just though of something, I wear Arborwear pants with gusseted crotch. Seems to help quite a bit when the legstraps wander.
-moss


Wed Jan 06, 2010 3:17 pm
Profile WWW
User avatar

Joined: Wed Apr 25, 2007 10:25 am
Posts: 4062
Location: Jamaica Plain, Massachusetts
Post 
Further comment on Oak's pinching question...

Make sure your leg strap pads are adjusted so the bottom of the pad is just above back of your knee. The Arborwear pants with gusseted crotch make a big difference. Sierra Trading Post sometimes has Arborwear stuff on sale. I find that attaching the biner holding the hitch to the leg strap D decreases pinching rather than increases it because it causes me to sit back more. When I'm more vertical on the rope and am loading the hitch or ascender in SRT the leg straps tend to move up. When I'm ascending DRT or SRT I'm trying to actually load the hitch or ascender very little if that make sense, arms/hands are on the ascenderor hitch and my feet are on the rope, the hitch is just riding so the saddle isn't loading up. If I want to rest I sit back, if there's any pinching a quick tug on a leg pad takes care of it. A combination of everything above seems to work.
-moss


Mon Jan 11, 2010 8:31 am
Profile WWW
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 20, 2009 9:56 am
Posts: 130
Location: Oakland, California
Post 
The first harness I had was too small, so I learned to juggle and adjust, then buckled down and bought a cup. Works a lot better. With my more appropriately sized Tengu, it's not as much of a problem but I still tend to wear the cup or adjust like Moss details.

Going to look at the Arborwear pants with the gusseted crotch!

_________________
John


Mon Jan 11, 2010 3:05 pm
Profile
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Reply to topic   [ 42 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3  Next

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 0 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group.
Designed by STSoftware for PTF.